Weak production

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nickname
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Weak production

#1 Post by nickname » Sat 21 Sep 2019, 2:56 pm

I've been listening some songs from the last PSB albums. I have to admit Stuart has given to PSB a young touch to their music but at the same time, everything sounds easy, dull and weak.

The problem is I love up tempo and anthemic songs and when PSB think about working more complex producers like Trevor Horn, they usually make downtempo albums (Fundamental, Elysium) and when the create uptempo albums they call Xenomania or Price. Creating a more simple production.

Dreamland is a good song but the production is so weak (a mix between Winner and The Way It Used To Be).

A little example of a good production outside PSB, where PSB's music could fit perfectly:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=chSZCtLrgz8

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jamie1978
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Re: Weak production

#2 Post by jamie1978 » Sat 21 Sep 2019, 2:58 pm

From your post is it self-evidently true that you have absolutely no idea what 'production' is.

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Re: Weak production

#3 Post by nickname » Sat 21 Sep 2019, 3:02 pm

jamie1978 wrote:
Sat 21 Sep 2019, 2:58 pm
From your post is it self-evidently true that you have absolutely no idea what 'production' is.
Ok, call it music atmosphere or whatever.

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jules
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Re: Weak production

#4 Post by jules » Sat 21 Sep 2019, 4:14 pm

Christine and the queens lol, sometimes the production is quite simplistic too.
https://youtu.be/MdIvdGoLJRU
julien676.skyblog.com

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glennjridge
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Re: Weak production

#5 Post by glennjridge » Sun 22 Sep 2019, 1:25 am

The production isnt weak, but it is more electronic. While fundamental wasnt perfect song wise....to me it is the perfect type of production. it was a mix of full on electronic tracks such as "Minimal" and Psychological,Integral, alongside ones that were more orchestrated with acoustic guitars, such as "indefinite leave to remain,Luna park,Numb etc etc". same with Nightlife. you had "radiophonic and For your own good, mixed with "You only tell me you love me when your drunk, and Vampires".

fairly recently they have taken a sort of hard left towards all one type of production style. Electric and Super and even alot of Elysium are fairly one note as far as track production. I would prefer they move back more towards the middle with at least a few more orchestrated songs. "forgotten child" seems like a nice step in that direction.

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jasonjohn
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Re: Weak production

#6 Post by jasonjohn » Sun 22 Sep 2019, 7:23 am

Didn't want to reply to this, because it's clear the OP is confusing production with his own personal taste, but here I am.

They love Stuart because they can send off demos and he comes back with a fully mixed track without too much energy spent on their part (by comparison!, I imagine the process would still be heavy!). Since leaving traditional record companies, this type of immediate production is working great for them. Price is great at what he does, and he's more varied than what he is credited for.

There's no point criticising any of it, because they actually love sparse, minimal sound anyway. (most of their demos lean that way, and not just because they are demos).

Fundamental is terrific, in my mind. It has "songs", rather than just mixes. It has a rich eclectic sound. I love all the lyrics and ideas they've put into it. Electric is great too, just different.

I sometimes wonder if Super could have been a double EP style album.... Super for all the Very-style "songs" and Superfluous for all the mesmerising mixes..... that would have kept both camps happy, instead of fighting on the streets. (I don't just mean a bonus disc)

I'd love it if they officially made a double album along those lines. To highlight their two modes. Except they probably have three or four.

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Parkol
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Re: Weak production

#7 Post by Parkol » Sun 22 Sep 2019, 8:16 am

Dreamland of of the rarest PSB songs I don't want to listen to again.
Every PSB song has a magic, but not this track.
Compare I wouldn't normally do... or Suburbia with Dreamland. There is no magic in Dreamland, no interesting ideas in the track, just a song.
And the sound is flat for me.

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Re: Weak production

#8 Post by Eleven » Sun 27 Oct 2019, 11:12 pm

I agree its a very flat song, I was interested for a few days only...
The main problem is Neil and Chris did this song by themselves and passed the demo to Stuart and he just put some loops bass and tech stuff to make it sound good but even the vocals are a bit out of tempo and some bits sound too artificial

Tim Powell did a more coherent work with Agenda tracks and my guess is that they are.already willing to work in the near future for a full album with Tim, writing songs focused on him, etc
Sounds like Very and Yes combined style and that would be a very good End album/s to what Pet Shop Boys mean.

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Re: Weak production

#9 Post by Acg » Tue 29 Oct 2019, 7:42 pm

I hope Neil and Chris read these message boards as I put the new Dreamland 12" on my turntable and the sound is ropey in the extreme. I couldn't even get to the end of the first track it was so compressed, flattened and rounded off at the edges. Frankly, if you're going to bother releasing physical versions of new music you may as well put a bit of effort into the mastering and pressing.
The frustrating think is that It doesn't have to be like this; by comparison the Love is a Bourgeois Construct 12" sounds superb - clear, crisp and deep. Likewise, listen to a decent copy of Introspective, Actually or Behaviour and subtle production flourishes are everywhere. And when they remastered them even more of the production revealed itself.
How disappointing then that the latest release just sounds so flat, despite being a decent PSB tune. It feels like it's been drag-and-dropped together on a MacBook during Stuart Price's lunchbreak. CDs and vinyl should be involving enough to encourage you to bother playing them.

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retrofuturist
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Re: Weak production

#10 Post by retrofuturist » Tue 29 Oct 2019, 11:51 pm

Greetings,

If you go back and listen to Minimal, you get a good case study highlighting how multiple layers of sound can interact and remain sonically crisp, without sounding like they've been clipped and crushed by compression algorithms.

"Light and shade" indeed...

Retro. :)

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Re: Weak production

#11 Post by james23_uk » Wed 30 Oct 2019, 2:27 am

Agreed, the flat sound from Dreamland is terrible. I thought it was a dodgy MP3 when I first heard it but the physical release is just the same. Shame as I quite like the song but it is almost unlistenable on good sound equipment.

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Re: Weak production

#12 Post by markrobertnolan » Thu 31 Oct 2019, 11:38 am

jamie1978 wrote:
Sat 21 Sep 2019, 2:58 pm
From your post is it self-evidently true that you have absolutely no idea what 'production' is.
Agreed.

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Re: Weak production

#13 Post by speee » Thu 31 Oct 2019, 4:13 pm

The problem is the weak mastering. I tried in my studio to enhance the highest frequencies and put a limiter around 300hz and it sounds 1000 times better. I can’t believe the engineer made such a poor job.
There’s also a problem in the production IMO. The vocals are way too different in eq. Neil and Olly voices sound so diverse in the way they are mixed. And the vocals aren’t properly tuned as well

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Re: Weak production

#14 Post by Parkol » Thu 31 Oct 2019, 6:00 pm

Like it or not, but I agree. Probably, in the studio it would sound better, but we don't live in the studios. I know some fans really hate how Stuart Price produce albums. I prefer if Xenomania or Trevor Horn work with PSB again. What I've noticed that I listen to Elysium, Fundamental, Agenda, but... I don't listen to Electric or Super so often. Yes, Pop Kids is very cool, but PSB should change their producer, even if their manager is his wife... Remixes are awful, the sound is too flat. I am sure Pete Gledal would make the sound better.

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Re: Weak production

#15 Post by Drico One » Thu 31 Oct 2019, 8:03 pm

Trevor Horn is 112 now and reduced to doing bizarre 80s nostalgia shows on German TV. I like Trevor, but it's clear he hasn't a clue that he worked with them as recently as 2006. He was part of the review panel on BBC Radio this year when On Social Media was up for judgement. It was obvious he's forgotten anything he did with them bar Left to my own devices and he's living in a permanent sepia-toned bubble that's forever stuck in 1989 like the DeLorean that he clearly drives. If they work with Trevor again, they may as well exhume the body of Eric Watson for their next photo shoot and disinter Derek Jarman for a video to be shot in the shadow of the Berlin Wall. They're'd be more life in them than Trevor.

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The pale kid that hides in the attic behind his PC...

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