Pansexuality - what IS it?

[Deschanel]

I discriminate against trolls with their foul pretzel logic stinking up this place with defenses of pedophiles, yes.

You're full of shit. I'm only sorry to give you the attention you deperately crave here.

Soon though, it might not be tomorrow, it might not be this week. But Scapa, you are a grotesque troll and you know it, and your number is coming up.

[York Minster]

I doubt you were born with a foot fetish. I think early in your development you saw something about a females foot that your brain turned into a sexual object. I think it happens so early that you dont remember it.

maybe psychological reason,like you saw something with a childhood friend or mother when you had a first glimmer of sexuality and it imprinted itself,or neurological reason, like your brain hardwiring fuses a body part with a sexual organ.

I say you cant be born with it cause theres people into shoe fetishes and I see no way your pre born brain can fetishize a shoe when it has no idea what a shoe is.now apply that to pretty much all fetishes and I think its just something very early in development psychologically or neurologically.

Glenn, your discussion here is not unreasonable, but I must strongly disagree with you. If you look at foot fetish distribution, perhaps some 20 percent of males of a foot fetish (the largest of all "fetishes"), while almost no women have a fetish for mens feet. In fact, perhaps upward of 20 percent of women have foot phobias. However, lesbian women do sometimes like womens feet, and gay men often like mens feet. Because of this, and because of my own experience, I believe it's as inborn as can be. I have many perversions, and they are all socially based, except for feet. For me, looking at a nice looking foot, I feel like I am seeing what other must see in women's boobs (I like boobs ok, but I'm more a butt man). The theory is that in the humonculous in the brain, the area for the genitals and feet is very close and something overlapping has occured. I don't believe in that theory one way or the other, I think it's too preliminary. But I've asked many women about their foot phobias and almost all say it's probably something that was present at birth. Feet are a part of the body, very much unlike shoes. You are right on with your analyisis of shoe fetish, or any other fetish of that sort. In that case, something enviornmental must occur. As for the old Freudian view that a man might like feet because he is too scared to pay attention to the main object and all that, it's simply nonsense.

[York Minster]

I discriminate against trolls with their foul pretzel logic stinking up this place with defenses of pedophiles, yes.

You're full of shit. I'm only sorry to give you the attention you deperately crave here.

Soon though, it might not be tomorrow, it might not be this week. But Scapa, you are a grotesque troll and you know it, and your number is coming up.

Ah, then you did misunderstand me. As I'm not trolling in my discussion of pedofiles. If I was, perhaps I would be defending adult/child sex, which I haven't.

But, how about, instead of just declaring me a troll, swearing at me, and declaring my logic to be of the "foul pretzal" variety, to tell us why a pedofile, who does not act on his urges, should not be an object of respect?

I think any resaonsable person can tell by my tone in this thread, and in my discussions with ragga and glenn, and even my responses to skyhigh, that I only discuss what I actually believe in, that there is no "put on" or troll here. I have been known to be overly goofy or silly or write the word "poop" too much. Yes, guilty. And I even DO crave attention. But I actually started this thread to try to learn about pansexuality, which still no one has discussed in any depth. But I'll not bother to respond to you again unless you issue a detailed response to something I said, not just name calling and calling me a phony.

[glennjridge]

on the one hand I understand what scalpa is saying. he's saying if one has the misfortune of being saddled with the pedophilia craving which I imagine is a powerful craving, for those that actually fight it...fight this sick desire and deny themselves this, it really is a extraordinary thing in my mind and I applaud them.

on the other hand I think they should be deported to canada as its too important to save our children and not allow these people to walk among us as apparently from what I hear the stats are they are the worst re offenders there are. they really are the most insidious kind of evil there is, how they groom little kids.

[York Minster]

on the one hand I understand what scalpa is saying. he's saying if one has the misfortune of being saddled with the pedophilia craving which I imagine is a powerful craving, for those that actually fight it...fight this sick desire and deny themselves this, it really is a extraordinary thing in my mind and I applaud them.

on the other hand I think they should be deported to canada as its too important to save our children and not allow these people to walk among us as apparently from what I hear the stats are they are the worst re offenders there are. they really are the most insidious kind of evil there is, how they groom little kids.

I can understand your concern glenn, but no such utilitarian answer is possible. Unfortunately, social scientists tell us around that around 1 out of every 6 girls or so (give or take) was sexually abused when they were young. Of course, not all of this is adult/child, but even so, this is a shocking fact. If you have a classroom of 30 students, chances are near 100 percent that one of the girls in the class was sexually abused by an adult growing up. And yet, the outrage stays on pedofiles, when really it's opportunists. Yes, it's everyday immoral actions by Uncle Joe and Step Dad John that make that statistic what it is. Even on the show that was infamous in the US a few years back "To Catch a Predator", you will note it wasn't to catch a pedofile. The girls they were supposedly talking to were 12 or 13, which is borderline, but most of these men were just opportunists who wanted a girl alone in a house. Even Chris Hanson admits that most of these men aren't pedofiles in an interview. Remember too, that when you are in a store with 20 men in it, it's very very likely one of these men has had sexual relations with a child. If you ask me, that's where all the upset should be directed. Most of these people never get reported and get away with acts that effect the children for life. America has a SEVERE moral panic over pedofiles and thinks most all are predators and also thinks they number in the millions. If you ask 100 18-24 year olds today, what would your reaction be if you watched a film and child nudity occured in it? A LARGE majority will answer "that's sick" or, that'd be wrong, I'd turn it off". Yet, obviously, in Europe, naked children have been in many movies. This, indeed, is a social construction. But if you'd all like to get upset at someone talking reasonabley about these issues, go ahead then. It's the unfortunate norm here in the US.

[Corina]

... if one has the misfortune of being saddled with the pedophilia craving which I imagine is a powerful craving, for those that actually fight it...fight this sick desire and deny themselves this, it really is a extraordinary thing in my mind and I applaud them.

I think the easiest way to help pedophiles fight their sick cravings is castration.

on the other hand I think they should be deported to canada as its too important to save our children...

Why Canada? They have children there too. Or maybe you mean the frozen wasteland in the far North, in that case I agree.

[raggatwin]

Castration does not work for these creatures. The biggest sex organ is the brain. There was a case in sweden a few years ago where aa castrated paedophile continued to abuse children, yes paedophiles don't discriminate in terms of gender contrary to popular belief. Because he couldn't get an erection he used, amongst other things, a pool cue.

[Corina]

^^ In this case, there`s only Canada left... Forced labour, minimum food, harsh conditions, gulag-style...

[raggatwin]

Yes something should be done with them, their re-offending rate is very high even after treatment- much higher than men who rape women. The question though is thus, Is there condition pathological or sociological? In my opinion its probably a bit of both. They have a complete lack of respect for social norms but has been discussed above social norms are relative and therefore contextual. Forgot to mention that Scapa is right as far as recorded onstances of child abuse, most tend to be victims of family members rather than often quoted folk devil, the predatory paedophile hanging around the park.

Its interesting though that some have defended friend of neil tennant, peter tatchell, on a very sililar theme to the sentiments expressed by Scapa on these boards......

[skyhigh]

Wonder how many paedophiles base their desires on theory.....

[raggatwin]

I think Freudians account for foot fetishes as developmental. Boys kept at a distance from their mother, usually at her feet and therefore do not develop a full attachment.

Scapa I've just read you think sex with sixteen year olds is okay, can you clarify this position please? I teach sixteen year olds and they really are rather silly. Please do not see this as a reversal, I still accept the social construction perspective, though do not condone sex with children..... or sixteen year olds...

[gregf]

@scapaflow.

That picture of Obama is used by the extreme right in America, the Klu Klux Clan right.
I find it even more disturbing then your discussion here.
You really are circling the drain hole aren't you.

This is a worth while community ; my advice is to value being here.

[raggatwin]

Klukos, Greek for impenertable circle, conindentally....

[York Minster]

I think Freudians account for foot fetishes as developmental. Boys kept at a distance from their mother, usually at her feet and therefore do not develop a full attachment.

Scapa I've just read you think sex with sixteen year olds is okay, can you clarify this position please? I teach sixteen year olds and they really are rather silly. Please do not see this as a reversal, I still accept the social construction perspective, though do not condone sex with children..... or sixteen year olds...

It depends on age and maturity of both parties. Most 16 year olds are immature in our world. But some are not. If the other party is, say 16 or 18 years old, then I find no problem with it at all. Could I concieve of a 30 year old and 16 year old working sexually together? Perhaps, though in general, that doesn't seem like a good idea. It's not a black and white issue. Just calling all 16 year olds "rather silly" doesn't work as an argument for me (but I do understand what you mean).

[York Minster]

Wonder how many paedophiles base their desires on theory.....

Probably none?