New album Nonetheless

[jules]

This album is strange. The problem i have is the number of song. They are so prolific, why not putting one or two more song ?

The electronic part of the album is very minimalistic and some tracks sounds very simple while some are gorgeous (like the secret of hapiness or love is the law).
The track i don't like very much is new london boy, it really is simple, lazy and cliche, in my opinion.. It lacks synth elements. Maybe it will grow on me, not sure, or it's the way Neil sings not very pleasant to me.

I like bullet for narcissus, especially when the strings kick in, but the electronic part is very light and seems rather generic. That being saud it totally works for me.

It's overall a great album but sometimes it gives the impression that it's just string orchestrations put on keyboards samples.

[Vintage Youth]

I would love to understand why so many people dislike The secret of happiness. To me, it's the best song on the album, something completely new and fresh with its bossa nova-inspired sounds, lyrics that have layers and layers of meaning, and the ambiance it builds is excellent. Maybe it's because I grew up listening to Gilberto and Jobim's music so it sounds natural and cohesive to me (and to the rest of the album).

I've been thinking about this, so I can't speak for anyone else, but for me, the track is in the style of a lot of easy listening/lounge/'elevator' music that people the age of my grandparents would have listened to and as kids, we would have instantly reacted badly to as it was so deeply uncool (opposition reflex!!).
This style was then pastiched by situation comedies, comedians and musical acts like the Mike Flowers Pops and Richard Cheese.
For people of Neil's generation, and he was clearly on a nostalgia kick making this album, whatever he says in interviews, that style would be bathed in the warm fuzzy romantic glow of the past, for me it reminds me of a fusty front room and a scratchy record player and a piano full of woodworm and wanting my Nan or uncle to bog off to the living room and watch Countdown so I could listen to MY *cool* records.
No reflection on the vocal or melody at all, with a different backing track I might feel completely different but currently it just does nothing for me. Conversely there is music I heard in that house that I still love, like Glenn Miller/trad jazz/big band and silver and brass band stuff, classic war film themes (oof) etc etc.

[Vintage Youth]

Double post.

[TallThinMan]

Depending on mood, ‘The secret of happiness’ is frequently my favourite song on this album. I’ve never understood this idea that all Pet Shop Boys’ songs should follow the same template.

[innerxsanctum]

I would love to understand why so many people dislike The secret of happiness. To me, it's the best song on the album, something completely new and fresh with its bossa nova-inspired sounds, lyrics that have layers and layers of meaning, and the ambiance it builds is excellent. Maybe it's because I grew up listening to Gilberto and Jobim's music so it sounds natural and cohesive to me (and to the rest of the album).

I've been thinking about this, so I can't speak for anyone else, but for me, the track is in the style of a lot of easy listening/lounge/'elevator' music that people the age of my grandparents would have listened to and as kids, we would have instantly reacted badly to as it was so deeply uncool (opposition reflex!!).
This style was then pastiched by situation comedies, comedians and musical acts like the Mike Flowers Pops and Richard Cheese.
For people of Neil's generation, and he was clearly on a nostalgia kick making this album, whatever he says in interviews, that style would be bathed in the warm fuzzy romantic glow of the past, for me it reminds me of a fusty front room and a scratchy record player and a piano full of woodworm and wanting my Nan or uncle to bog off to the living room and watch Countdown so I could listen to MY *cool* records.
No reflection on the vocal or melody at all, with a different backing track I might feel completely different but currently it just does nothing for me. Conversely there is music I heard in that house that I still love, like Glenn Miller/trad jazz/big band and silver and brass band stuff, classic war film themes (oof) etc etc.

Interesting because I'm from South America so for us bossa nova (same as boleros to name another example) is an essential part of our childhood (and I'm 25). We look fondly to those early mornings listening to this kind of music with our grandparents and we never thought of it as "easy listening" or "elevator music" because that doesn't exist here as a concept or genre, it's more of an acquired term from anglophone movies. Actually, I was pleasantly surprised when Neil picked Amoroso by João Gilberto in Annually 2021 because he was one of the artists I remember growing up with.

[Vintage Youth]

Interesting because I'm from South America so for us bossa nova (same as boleros to name another example) is an essential part of our childhood (and I'm 25). We look fondly to those early mornings listening to this kind of music with our grandparents and we never thought of it as "easy listening" or "elevator music" because that doesn't exist here as a concept or genre, it's more of an acquired term from anglophone movies. Actually, I was pleasantly surprised when Neil picked Amoroso by João Gilberto in Annually 2021 because he was one of the artists I remember growing up with.

It is indeed really interesting to see how different peoples' upbringing and culture influences our musical tastes!
Neil is definitely influenced by things he has heard on his travels.

[Gabby]

I would love to understand why so many people dislike The secret of happiness. To me, it's the best song on the album, something completely new and fresh with its bossa nova-inspired sounds, lyrics that have layers and layers of meaning, and the ambiance it builds is excellent. Maybe it's because I grew up listening to Gilberto and Jobim's music so it sounds natural and cohesive to me (and to the rest of the album).

I've been thinking about this, so I can't speak for anyone else, but for me, the track is in the style of a lot of easy listening/lounge/'elevator' music that people the age of my grandparents would have listened to and as kids, we would have instantly reacted badly to as it was so deeply uncool (opposition reflex!!).
This style was then pastiched by situation comedies, comedians and musical acts like the Mike Flowers Pops and Richard Cheese.
For people of Neil's generation, and he was clearly on a nostalgia kick making this album, whatever he says in interviews, that style would be bathed in the warm fuzzy romantic glow of the past, for me it reminds me of a fusty front room and a scratchy record player and a piano full of woodworm and wanting my Nan or uncle to bog off to the living room and watch Countdown so I could listen to MY *cool* records.
No reflection on the vocal or melody at all, with a different backing track I might feel completely different but currently it just does nothing for me. Conversely there is music I heard in that house that I still love, like Glenn Miller/trad jazz/big band and silver and brass band stuff, classic war film themes (oof) etc etc.

I agree that it musters some images/smells of a time gone by. The smell of smoke in the living room and bad Saturday night BBC light entertainment shows (Val Doonican anyone?). The sheer boredom of it all as a kid, after cowering behind the sofa watching Doctor Who.

That being said, I rather have a soft spot for this music now - it's cheesy but fun and I almost wish Neil and Chris (and James) had leaned into the sound even more - gone full on. Maybe that would have come across as too tongue in cheek for them, but I think it would have been quite good. It sits quite nicely with "Give it a go" in that sense.

[herts101]

I really struggle to like it and hold off from skipping. It’s interesting that Chris had nothing to do with it.

I think it’s also that it’s so long in contrast to the others. Maybe it’ll grow on me in time though.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[spacewalker]

I'm free from cultural influences that make everyone dislike anything related to "elevator music", so Secret of happiness is still my favorite song on this album. It's just very beautiful and peaceful. And that chorus, wow.
It's definitely on the lounge side of bossa nova and I'd really like them to go full bossa nova mode with soft Neil's vocals, complex guitar rhythms, 129 jazz chords in every song and lyrics about political situation in Brazil's 1960s. Chico Buarque is alive and they can collaborate.

[Ghost within this house]

I'm working up to writing a proper review at some point, but have really found that The secret of happiness and A new bohemia are the two songs to have grown on me most... they are like a pair of comfortable slippers for greying Petheads - sublime songs you feel you'll never tire of.

I always imagine Nickname and others approaching songs like they are inspecting a piece of beef, sniffing it before declaring that it won't fetch highest prices at the fancy restaurants... not liking the sound stage of Nonetheless is one thing, but suggesting they failed to produce a certain sound and that the synths are 'cheap' (what does that even mean?) seems rather moronic to me.

Everything on Nonetheless sounds beautifully and very deliberately crafted, and the songs have room to breathe... oh, and lyrically, it's their best album since Fundamental. Listen to the bassline on New London Boy on a really good sound system (or Sennheiser Momentum 4s), for instance, well, it's a thing of beauty - clean, resonant, satisfying, in ways that an 80s recording isn't. These songs might be stylistically retro, but they are sonically fresh and current.

[vincenzosz]

I'm working up to writing a proper review at some point, but have really found that The secret of happiness and A new bohemia are the two songs to have grown on me most... they are like a pair of comfortable slippers for greying Petheads - sublime songs you feel you'll never tire of.

I always imagine Nickname and others approaching songs like they are inspecting a piece of beef, sniffing it before declaring that it won't fetch highest prices at the fancy restaurants... not liking the sound stage of Nonetheless is one thing, but suggesting they failed to produce a certain sound and that the synths are 'cheap' (what does that even mean?) seems rather moronic to me.

Everything on Nonetheless sounds beautifully and very deliberately crafted, and the songs have room to breathe... oh, and lyrically, it's their best album since Fundamental. Listen to the bassline on New London Boy on a really good sound system (or Sennheiser Momentum 4s), for instance, well, it's a thing of beauty - clean, resonant, satisfying, in ways that an 80s recording isn't. These songs might be stylistically retro, but they are sonically fresh and current.

Cheap is the difference between the music of Sega Genesis games (known to be inferior) and the music of Super Nintendo games (known to be superior due to a Sony sound chip).
Cheap is the difference between the karaoke covers of Michael Jackson songs versus the original Michael Jackson song.
Cheap is the difference between the sounds on any Pet Shop Boys demo versus the studio version.

[le petit corbusier]

Cheap is the difference between the music of Sega Genesis games (known to be inferior) and the music of Super Nintendo games (known to be superior due to a Sony sound chip).
Cheap is the difference between the karaoke covers of Michael Jackson songs versus the original Michael Jackson song.
Cheap is the difference between the sounds on any Pet Shop Boys demo versus the studio version.

Sega Genesis known to be inferior? SNES came 3 years later but had tons of bad games, just as the Mega drive had bad games too. They had very different sound technologies. The sound of the Snes was based on sampling, which gave it its unique sound signature. The Mega drive had a Yamaha YM2612 FM chip (a synthesizer), and a certain Yuzo Koshiro (even Michael Jackson) would strongly disagree with the assessment that it was inferior. I mean, Yuzo Koshiro performed the Streets of Rage soundtrack at Sónar festival and it was glorious. He has been touring for years now with that old Sega Mega Drive sound system.

Furthermore, the original hardware is still being used by small creators online and you can even download an official Sega Mega Drive package on Korg Gadget for Nintendo Switch or iOS so you can use that iconic sound chip on modern platforms.

Different or older doesn't mean inferior.


Yuzo Koshiro live:
https://youtu.be/mW03QgubN0M?si=LWD4J3EN3qfdIjMg

Streets of Rage music analysis:
https://youtu.be/2cx73EOaGWU?si=ZlxmkBfPz25Rnta0

Michael Jackson and Sonic 3 soundtrack:
https://t.ly/G7Fn5

Korg Gadget and Sega:
https://youtu.be/bnEVlQ4xolA?si=whXxu9nYulQZe9PL

Some guy turned a Mega Drive into a huge synthesiser:
https://youtu.be/V0kq0yCTpNE?si=Z6xE4X4oMX9ASyd_
https://youtu.be/S-02iH6l308?si=BqCjsQfL50N3aT4m

Triggered Sega fanboy here.

[Vintage Youth]

I learn something new every day on here!!

[leesmapman]

TBH, Yuzo Koshiro makes magic with everything. I have several of his early soundtracks (for Ys 1 and 2) and they're amazing.

For the quality of the sound chips: compare Simon's theme for SNES and Megadrive
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3bV4QnvauC4

[le petit corbusier]

TBH, Yuzo Koshiro makes magic with everything. I have several of his early soundtracks (for Ys 1 and 2) and they're amazing.

For the quality of the sound chips: compare Simon's theme for SNES and Megadrive
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3bV4QnvauC4

Ah, yes, the Ys soundtracks are awesome.

Regarding Castlevania, even if in this case the Mega Drive wins, you really can't compare sampling and a synth. It's just an unfair thing to do. Comparing the Nes and the Sega Master System would be fair and in that case Nintendo would win most times.

Having said that, witness the greatness of The Mega Drive/Genesis thanks to that other genius called Tim Follin:

https://youtu.be/iXFd6M_6Nto?si=PnsKVZ5T7mS5zsTt
https://youtu.be/Cb8bEGqQWVA?si=QL1AxkxIfeVHQQIw