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Posted: Fri 12 May 2006, 8:25 pm
by Alcibiades
What about OMD's "Enola Gay"?
By using the same arguments it should feel macabre and distasteful to sing and 'romanticise' about the brutal mass murderation of thousands of helpless civilians with the deadliest WMD ever made.
Or does the fact that most of us feel stranger to the victims of the nuclear holocaust make us "blase and carefree"?
I say long live challenging art.
Posted: Fri 12 May 2006, 8:40 pm
by Shadilly
I think it clearly shows that victims of terrorism are on BOTH sides, and anyone claiming that terrorists are not human beings are as far off as the terrorist him/herself.
We seem to think that terrorists are bred by armys in some loveless desert, but a suicide bomber have a family that are as devostated by terrorism as the bombers victims family.
Before we accept this fact, we will fail to put a stop to terrorism.
It is a very intelligent and sensitive song, that do not show any sympathy for terrorism, but for its victims.
Posted: Fri 12 May 2006, 8:56 pm
by TrasTornado
If there is a possibility for a 4th single, after Stupid, Minimal and Numb (confirmed?), this is the real contender for Integral or Sodom. Right now I think Fugitive is the best... of all. I shall pass the first listenings impact, then time will tell for me.
It's so wonderfull that I don't know if I have to cry or dance...
NEIL DO SOMETHING ! ! !
Posted: Fri 12 May 2006, 9:19 pm
by Undertaker
In many people's eyes, Bush is a terrorist and i didn't hear any complaints towards the line ''Is stupid really stupid, or a different kind of smart?''
Dave
Posted: Fri 12 May 2006, 9:56 pm
by stussyboy
Like I'm with Stupid, it's just a love song with many different levels.
Like Morrissey, Neil realises that people who do bad things can fall in love too.
Posted: Fri 12 May 2006, 10:10 pm
by Monty--
Zog wrote:Monty-- wrote:I can't really enjoy a song if its basically about nine 11. How can you sing along with that? I feel the same with films made about 9/11. I refuse to watch them. They are forms of entertainment and should not be viewed as such.
I hope you didn't watch "The Titanic" or any other disaster movie based on (or close to) real events.
-Zog
It's different, Zog. I mean, I could watch something about 'Jack The Ripper', but I couldn't watch a film about a murderer, say..Harold Shipman from Manchester UK for example. It's too soon and it's too raw. 9/11 effected most of us and we were caught up in the fall out from it. I can't relate to 'The Titanic' because it hsn't effected me as much.
Posted: Fri 12 May 2006, 10:25 pm
by patrick
Monty-- wrote:9/11 effected most of us and we were caught up in the fall out from it.
How many people were directly affected by 9/11? I think when history looks back we'll see that most people were more affected by media manipulation than anything else. I don't think we'd see this mock outrage if the PSB sang about Rwanda.
Posted: Fri 12 May 2006, 10:47 pm
by mole973102
TrasTornado wrote:NEIL DO SOMETHING ! ! !
Are you an unknown popstar?
Re: Fugitive: Love Song for 9/11 Terrorists
Posted: Fri 12 May 2006, 11:00 pm
by Docoboy
Deschanel wrote:If PSB and Neil Tennant wants to characterize, and romanticize, the 9/11 hijackers as heroes, it's his right to do so.
Haven't heard the song yet, but can't imagine this would be the intention. I remember after 9/11 Neil saying on the website how concerned he was about friends of his in New York. Similarly after the London bombings, a moving quote from Ken Livingstone was posted on the website saying something along the lines of "the terrorists have lost".
Posted: Sat 13 May 2006, 12:18 am
by will_castano
RE lyrics, I think it's "indivisible" not "into visible".
Re: Fugitive: Love Song for 9/11 Terrorists
Posted: Sat 13 May 2006, 1:33 am
by Syncratic
Deschanel wrote:I liked this track..
but now I want to vomit.
It's a love song, romanticising Mohammed Atta.
It's a tribute to the romantic bravery of the 9/11 hijackers.
Never mind the men, women, and infants aboard those planes, their pain and terror when they knew their fates.
This is what "Fuigitive" is about?
Romanticizing murderers, who slit pilots' throats, to traumatize the world and my city, NYC.
I'm shaken. I am blown away that Neil Tennant wrote such a song, no matter how badly he hates Bush. There's millions of us who do as well. And November elections are coming..
Martin Amis wrote a story for the New Yorker magazine, "The Last Day of Muhammed Atta".
It's fairly scorching in its characterizations. On the contrary, "Fugitive" is an ecstatic meditation, highly sympathetic, to the presumably high ideals of thise murderers.
Apparently Neil is too above it all when he romanticizes what it takes to slit a man's throat and crash the planes into buildings.
If PSB and Neil Tennant wants to characterize, and romanticize, the 9/11 hijackers as heroes, it's his right to do so.
But I am utterly shaken and nauseated that PSB thought they should do so.
I'm extremely disgusted, but perhaps that was the pointless f***ing point.
Martin Amis beat you to it Neil. Fusk!~ I liked the song but it makes me sick to hear it now.
Big f*** deal. Put your copy of the Daiy Mail away, turn off self-righteous mode and look at the bigger picture. It's a pop song. It's contemporary and no subject should be censored.
I think you have to be rather thick to see it as an exlusive tribute. I think it's an ode to brotherhood and fighting for your ideals no matter how contraversial.
For all we know it may be about 7/7 and not your beolved NYC. But whatever, Neil does write from different points of view, why should this be any different, and why the hell should he restrain from writing a song from another angle? Hell, I find all the pomp, and insincerity and 'charity' songs that came from 911 far more offensive to the memories of the victims.
It's a fantastic and beautiful song, with or without the not so subtle context, and I don't feel it 'romanticises' terrorism, but emphasies it's futility and pointlessness, in a life which in many ways is meaningless.
edit-sorry about spelling mistakes I'm pissed.
Posted: Sat 13 May 2006, 8:08 am
by Kandu
I do not agree with the point this song is a tribute to terrorists. Neil once said he tried to write songs from a woman's point of view. Why not write a song from a terrorist's point of view?. That's it.
I am Spanish. I'm in Spain. We have been suffering from terrorism for more than thirty years now. I know what I am talking about. You are not the only ones in this planet who have suffered from it mate, unfortunately.
Posted: Sat 13 May 2006, 9:15 am
by Monty--
patrick wrote:Monty-- wrote:9/11 effected most of us and we were caught up in the fall out from it.
How many people were directly affected by 9/11? I think when history looks back we'll see that most people were more affected by media manipulation than anything else. I don't think we'd see this mock outrage if the PSB sang about Rwanda.
Stop taking offence. And where this word 'directly' comes from is beyond me. Heh, and you're the one talking about manipulation. Yes, I was effected in more ways then one. And so was everybody else I knew. 'Mock outrage'? Meh. I'm not outraged. I don't like the idea behind it and its my right. You can tap your feet to a song about terrorists but I wont. It's blatantly obvious PSB are just looking at it from another perspective but I just don't like the idea about it. Anyone that thinks PSB are pro terrorists are idiots.
Posted: Sat 13 May 2006, 10:36 am
by Kandu
Monty-- wrote:I don't like the idea behind it and its my right.
Right.
Choose to do something else instead listening to that song. Then you will avoid listening to it. Neil did choose to write a song like that one. You have done the same when writing about your thought. That's called free wil. That's how it should work, but choose consciously please.
Posted: Sat 13 May 2006, 11:09 am
by Monty--
JLGY wrote:Monty-- wrote:I don't like the idea behind it and its my right.
Right.
Choose to do something else instead listening to that song. Then you will avoid listening to it. Neil did choose to write a song like that one. You have done the same when writing about your thought. That's called free wil. That's how it should work, but choose consciously please.
That's exactly what I've done. It's my choice and I voiced it on this thread which is relevant to the given topic. Whats the problem? It's a FORUM. I'm not slagging your band. It was a comment. Look, if people are going to get upset about this, why on earth are you clicking on the title on the main page to access this thread? I am going to skip that song. Big deal. My loss. But stop the confrontation. There's no need for it.