Pet Shop Boys Community

But you would have to admit I'm not some "idiot kid" who only listens to Timbaland and the like right? The world is more complex then this easy division between crap and not crap that you make.

Please read my posts. I said myself that I listen to some fluff every now and then. The problem isn't that Timbaland exists, but that he's mega popular compared to PSB or whoever. Priorities. Out of whack. Now that it's a bit greyer, any more questions please refer to my old posts, my views are there I'm sure.

Yes, it's clear what we each think on the matter. But you've given no indication why what you think are priorities in the world are actually the priorities the world needs. Instead you just state them as fact. About as good as the Bible. Remember, over half the world works in the field all day. Is that worse then working in an office building? If they sing simple hymns all day, is that worse then Being Boring? OR would you say those hymns have more content then, umm, glenny j?

And I think working in fields and offices are what breeds ignorance. And what's so hard about defining ignorance? The bible says believe in an invisible man or burn, and I say use your brain. Very apt comparison.

The owners don't want a nation of people capable of critical thinking. That's against their interests. They want people who are just smart enough to do the paperwork and run the machines, and just dumb enough to passively accept these increasingly shittier jobs, lower hours, reduced benefits... - George Carlin.

(and as a logical train of thought, their lowered intelligence is also reflected in their musical tastes - me).

all this talk of "owners" doing this an that and needing this and that.

the owners arent from another planet, they come from the people.
owners/offices/workers in the field..you....me...and 1 post above you homer simpson are all part of the problem. a human nature problem.

dont think because you fancy yourself a "critical" thinker that leaves you outside the tired cycle. you've been indoctrinated yourself,just by another group. theres no reason why I should believe a right winger who believes FOX is any more gullible then one on the left who buys into conspiracy theorys from their own talking heads.

tagging yourslf a critical thinker is just a little phony mechanism to make you feel you are outside the system when you are just like all those other people in the field.

Well, working in fields and/or hunting and gathering is our history (sans some conspiracy history). We don't know how urbanity started. Aristotle isn't all that helpful with it. So I'd like to know, in your opinion, when did humans start to get out of the ignorant state they were in (at least some of them), and how did they do it? Because remember, many books by "great" authors have the moral that tilling the fields is the best thing for you.

FirthofForth wrote:Well, working in fields and/or hunting and gathering is our history (sans some conspiracy history). We don't know how urbanity started. Aristotle isn't all that helpful with it. So I'd like to know, in your opinion, when did humans start to get out of the ignorant state they were in (at least some of them), and how did they do it? Because remember, many books by "great" authors have the moral that tilling the fields is the best thing for you.

Point of order. Working the fields allowed living in settled populations, which lead to cities. All are very recent developments compared to the bulk of human evolution. One could argue that agriculture was the first big technological step for mankind after millions of years of evolving as hunter-gatherers. Evolutionarily speaking, working the fields is no more the natural state of a man than working a PC.

Carry on...

Evolutionarily speaking, working the fields is no more the natural state of a man than working a PC.

Two issues: what is natural? no one REALLY knows. Should the theory of evolution and it's supposed teleological progress be applied to every discussion?

Sorry mate, but you're not dragging me into your pointless cyclical debate. Man was a hunter gatherer for a loooooong time before he ever tilled a field. This was my point.

You're the one who dragged yourself in, yfu.

FirthofForth wrote:You're the one who dragged yourself in, yfu.

Hmmm... "Pointless" is perhaps too harsh a term, but this thread does seem to be going nowhere. Anyway my sole intention was to correct a factual inaccuracy in one of your statements. That's all. I'm not really interested in debating the nature of knowledge right now.

I understand debating epistomology is not something most people like to get into. I do however. Excoriate me if you must.

Actually I do find the subject interesting, but I don't think that a thread about favourite artists on a music forum is the right place to do it justice.

Why not? As good a place as any I figure. It's not like those with a PHD in philosophy have any better answers on this stuff than anyone else. I also figure Pet Shop Boys fans here seem just as likely as anyone to have read Kant as far as the general population is concerned.