Yeah, this is absolutely correct. I think Chris was the one who even suggested the 'guitary' direction of Release in the first place. Plus, he was also influential in the layering of the guitar sounds on 'Boy Strange'.glennjridge wrote:oh about petshopgirlxxx comment about chris trying to save release by putting on here and samurai thats the thing, I was reading a literally I believe and neil was the one who wanted release to be more electronic while chris was saying 'this cant go on and that cant go on" because chris was the one sticking to the slower more guitar based idea.
personally I LOVE email.
The Night I Fell In Love...
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Kris
- Posts: 1162
- Joined: Sat 08 Nov 2003, 11:22 am
Passion, love, sex, money, violence, religion, injustice and death. More on that story later.
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psb-freak
- Posts: 6104
- Joined: Tue 28 Oct 2003, 4:42 pm
- Contact:
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Syncratic
- Posts: 1452
- Joined: Sun 01 Aug 2004, 1:33 am
[quote="Lovok"]OK, the artist in me is griping to come out. But before I go any further, I should put out the disclaimer that EVERYONE IS ENTITILED TO THEIR OWN OPINION.
And here's mine....
When I was in college and critiquing art work, I learned that saying something sucks isn't really enough. Enquiring mind want to know! WHY does it suck? WHY should've a particular song been a b-side? Some of the posters here really know how to analyze the ''why's" and ''because's"-YAY!
Others seem barely able to compose a coherent sentence (maybe it's more the english teacher coming out instead of the artist...
)
For being fans who claim they love the Boys, some of the remarks I'm reading are really scathing, and just plain over the top; empty statements without any details to back them up. If I were Neil and/or Chris, I think I'd eventually adopt a ''well, just bugger off then" attitude toward the fans. How bad would THAT suck for the rest of us?
"Release" was just so different from what they normally do, I don't think some of us were able to look at it AS being completely different and make that jump. It was a style they wanted to try, and I think they succeeded like they always seem to do. I would suggest that if anyone out there can get a chance to hear the interview CD called ''Re: Release" to do so. It may shed some light on why they made Release the way they did.
As artists, they have the right to be experimental. If you think the experiment failed, at least try to say WHY you think it failed instead of just putting a "This sucks" stamp on it.
OK, my rant is done for now....
[/quote]
Thing is, and you can maybe be excused as a newbie. Many of us have alread gone through the rational, constructive and analytical route. And still continue to do so. Believe me not all of us are adverse to using the word WHY, so maybe you don't intend to insult the small signs of intelligence on here. Many posters seem cynical for different reasons, so in that sense you need to take the older guys with a pinch of salt.
This Release debate is FOUR years old. Slightly more actually. In one of my first posts (at Sky forum I think) I actually defended the Boys right to make Release when one guy, Mike F or whatever (apparently he worked with Redman and had a really cool site,) gave the album the mother of bad and personal reviews and decided he was never gonna be a fan of the boys anymore, and anyone who still insisted on being a fan after this was stupid. That was the gist. And what made it even more of a silly childish and not very intelligent rant was that for the best part of a year he was telling everyone how good it was going to be, and how he was enjoying it.
So my advice is get used to the cynical nature, and abrupt posts. It goes with the territory, and as you no doubt will find out, is pretty boring without it.
In retrospect, Release is not as good as the other albums. They made a mistake, which, is the boys to make. As you said, you feel the biys are the best judges of what they make. True, and as fans we are the best judges of what we are prepared to buy and enjoy. Pop music is certainly a cut throat game.
And here's mine....
When I was in college and critiquing art work, I learned that saying something sucks isn't really enough. Enquiring mind want to know! WHY does it suck? WHY should've a particular song been a b-side? Some of the posters here really know how to analyze the ''why's" and ''because's"-YAY!
Others seem barely able to compose a coherent sentence (maybe it's more the english teacher coming out instead of the artist...
)For being fans who claim they love the Boys, some of the remarks I'm reading are really scathing, and just plain over the top; empty statements without any details to back them up. If I were Neil and/or Chris, I think I'd eventually adopt a ''well, just bugger off then" attitude toward the fans. How bad would THAT suck for the rest of us?
"Release" was just so different from what they normally do, I don't think some of us were able to look at it AS being completely different and make that jump. It was a style they wanted to try, and I think they succeeded like they always seem to do. I would suggest that if anyone out there can get a chance to hear the interview CD called ''Re: Release" to do so. It may shed some light on why they made Release the way they did.
As artists, they have the right to be experimental. If you think the experiment failed, at least try to say WHY you think it failed instead of just putting a "This sucks" stamp on it.
OK, my rant is done for now....
[/quote]Thing is, and you can maybe be excused as a newbie. Many of us have alread gone through the rational, constructive and analytical route. And still continue to do so. Believe me not all of us are adverse to using the word WHY, so maybe you don't intend to insult the small signs of intelligence on here. Many posters seem cynical for different reasons, so in that sense you need to take the older guys with a pinch of salt.
This Release debate is FOUR years old. Slightly more actually. In one of my first posts (at Sky forum I think) I actually defended the Boys right to make Release when one guy, Mike F or whatever (apparently he worked with Redman and had a really cool site,) gave the album the mother of bad and personal reviews and decided he was never gonna be a fan of the boys anymore, and anyone who still insisted on being a fan after this was stupid. That was the gist. And what made it even more of a silly childish and not very intelligent rant was that for the best part of a year he was telling everyone how good it was going to be, and how he was enjoying it.
So my advice is get used to the cynical nature, and abrupt posts. It goes with the territory, and as you no doubt will find out, is pretty boring without it.
In retrospect, Release is not as good as the other albums. They made a mistake, which, is the boys to make. As you said, you feel the biys are the best judges of what they make. True, and as fans we are the best judges of what we are prepared to buy and enjoy. Pop music is certainly a cut throat game.
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Lovok
Thanks Syncratic!
And now that you mention it, you're probably right in that the ''WHY'S" have been covered before, and as a ''newbie'', I probabaly missed the more in-depth comments and criticisms. If this is the case, I apologize for any offenses if the response to my post was "Jeez! I thought I went over already why I hate this!"
My intention in being here is to have fun and trade ideas. I NEVER want to be known as a jerk who deliberately antagonizes other PetHeads. Maybe a smart-ass from time to time, but never a jerk. 
I try to make my insults non-specific on what I perceive to be low-intelligence remarks; no need to point fingers when they pretty much know who I'm talking about anyway.
I always kinda wondered where the break was and how it came about with Mike F. Unless a person was directly involved and "heard it from the horse's mouth", I doubt the rest of us will ever really know the whole truth to the situation. But hey, I had a pretty good life beforehand, so I can live without knowing the gory, messy details.
I REALLY want to thank you again Syncratic, for not raking me over the coals. When you could've used a sledgehammer, you used a "calm down" pat on the shoulder instead.
But I STILL think "Release" isn't as bad as people may think. "That's muh story & I'ma stickin' to it!"
And now that you mention it, you're probably right in that the ''WHY'S" have been covered before, and as a ''newbie'', I probabaly missed the more in-depth comments and criticisms. If this is the case, I apologize for any offenses if the response to my post was "Jeez! I thought I went over already why I hate this!"
My intention in being here is to have fun and trade ideas. I NEVER want to be known as a jerk who deliberately antagonizes other PetHeads. Maybe a smart-ass from time to time, but never a jerk. I try to make my insults non-specific on what I perceive to be low-intelligence remarks; no need to point fingers when they pretty much know who I'm talking about anyway.
I always kinda wondered where the break was and how it came about with Mike F. Unless a person was directly involved and "heard it from the horse's mouth", I doubt the rest of us will ever really know the whole truth to the situation. But hey, I had a pretty good life beforehand, so I can live without knowing the gory, messy details.
I REALLY want to thank you again Syncratic, for not raking me over the coals. When you could've used a sledgehammer, you used a "calm down" pat on the shoulder instead.
But I STILL think "Release" isn't as bad as people may think. "That's muh story & I'ma stickin' to it!"
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Broooklyn
I possess the ability to elaborate further upon this particular track, but I really can not find the reasons to do so. I mean, do I have to extend my one word summarization to make it sound intelligent, just to come to the exact same conclusion to which one word expressed? Or, would you rather I simply ignore my thoughts upon this track, and try to find the hidden beauty within, that to my ears, just simply does not exist? Sometimes the simple face value of a one word response is quite sufficient enough, and when it comes to this particular song, for myself anyway, I believe that is more than enough energy wasted. If I put the words "Poetic garbage" into an artistic vase, would that be adequate enough?
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Broooklyn
*Puts the words Poetic Garbage in an artistic vase* Hmmm...*Stands back*....Nope...not quite right. *Adjusts lighting*....Interesting. *Polishes the vase to a glistening shine*.....Even more interesting....*Centers it just a touch, and stands back again*....Yes.....there it is...perfection. It definitely still sucks, but it looks so much better within this particular lighting and setting.
*Pops the cork on some white wine and settles into his chair to stare at it's intellectually stimulating presence*
*Pops the cork on some white wine and settles into his chair to stare at it's intellectually stimulating presence*
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Lovok
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Lush
- Posts: 515
- Joined: Sat 08 Nov 2003, 10:12 am
Couldn't have put it better myself. TNIFL belongs to an "elite" group af probably four or five songs that I really, really wish the boys wouldn't have done (the others including If Love Were all, Saturday Night Forever, and Electricity).Joemoz wrote:Come to think of it, it should never really have been conceived, much less recorded in the first place. It really is one of those songs that thorougly detracts from an album, rather than just not adding anything to it. What were they thinking when they did that? Eurgh.
"Unprofessional? Us? Sir. Might I with due respect remind you that Mister Vandemar and myself burned down the City of Troy? We brought the Black Plague to Flanders. We have assassinated a dozen kings, five popes, half a hundred heroes and two accredited gods. Our last commission before this was the torturing to death of an entire monastery in sixteenth century Tuscany. We are utterly professional." - Mr Croup
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Jareth
- Posts: 409
- Joined: Mon 16 Jan 2006, 11:05 pm
I liked reading Dr Dre's comments on the song.
Eminem was not available for comment, but MTV News played "The Night I Fell in Love" for his mentor and producer, Dr. Dre, who is referenced in a line from the song: "We joked about Dre and his homies."
"We needed another song anyway," Dre joked. "They just gave us a concept. Oh my God. I hope they can stand the backlash. That's funny as hell."
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YankeeMate
There's a simplicity to the lyrics because the characters are simple people. Obviously "the boy" doesn't have a wealth of vocabulary to express himself that comes with years of learning. "The rapper" has street language and may have been a school drop-out so he's not going to be as eloquent either. That's my impression of the simplistic lyrics.shamelessboyuk wrote:It's the whole cringe-factor lycrics:
Next morning we woke
he couldn't have been a nicer bloke
Over breakfast made jokes
about Dre and his homies and folks
Neither of us asked if or when
we would see each other again
but I thought that was cool
'cause Iwas already late for school
by then
This for me just generates a whole bunch of unpleasant thoughts. That last line still creeps up on me when I least expect it
On the whole, Samurai is the standout not because it's the best track but because it's different. It's the only electronica track on an album of guitar songs and looking at the concept of Release, IT is the one that should have been eliminated or subjected to b-side status. That's not to say it deserves to be, on the contrary, if it had been on an album like Actually or Very it would have fit in quite well. It doesn't belong on Release because the rest of the tracks force it to stick out like a sore thumb or blooming flower - depending on you're approach to the project.
I generally dislike guitar driven music. Piano, keys, synths, orchestral, string, most any other instrument as lead I don't mind. I can't place my finger on the reasons why but guitars don't please me. Release is one of my least favorite albums and the guitars are the sole reason why. I still like the lyrics and if the tracks were all synthesized, I bet it'd be a killer album. Having said that, ironically, TNIFIL and Here are my two favorite tracks off this album. Here grew on me via Disco 3. TNIFIL I can't explain my liking as it's not particularly impressive but it's still the most listenable of the set.
Has Eminem directed a reply in song back to PSB yet?