Forum changes very soon!!!!

[JSDOUVRES]

Thought I'd open a topic about the upcoming forum changes. Now what could they possibly be?

I'm thinking that they will involve banning freedom of speech because lately it has been a big issue for certain users of this forum.

My big question though is as follows: If a topic does not interest you or even offends you then do we all have the right to get that topic closed down? There are a hell of a lot of people on here who have a massive problem discussing things which although pretty important and very real, involve topics which are very scary indeed. Should fear be the winner here of is freedom of speech more important?

I have seen a user on this very website openly support violence, segregation and hatred but once again because of fear people refuse to speak out and in fact choose to speak out at ME for daring to talk about things in the first place!!!!

This is the off topic section of a website, meaning that in a free society (which we used to live in) we have the right to discuss what we want. And if you do not like the topic and do not want to read about it or comment about it then common sense should take over and you should ignore it. Yes, common sense.

Does anybody wonder why the terrible events like in Rotherham (oh my God, I must have offended somebody, no idea how though!) actually happen? The simple answer is because of the exact attitudes seen on this very website. It is a cancer in our society that spreads like wildfire and will end with the riots as predicted by Enoch Powell which is a tragedy. This country has allowed scum like the EDL and BNP to hijack what should be acceptable and supported opposition into things like extremism (without question we should oppose it) which because supported by them is now seen as a big no no and something we should all be quiet about. That is also a real tragedy. I feel that people in Britain now have the attitude that certain parts of society are untouchable which is truly shocking and incredibly unjust. Just look at the reaction to me? And the reason? Because I talk about things that make people feel uncomfortable so I therefore must be a racist? Absolutely pathetic. Until the day when we can all talk about everybody equally people in this country will always be at odds with each other which can only be a bad thing. Raggatwin confirmed everything when he posted that he was going to give the stats for sexual assaults on children by race in Britain. For very obvious reasons. He proved that to him that is what this is about when of course the main thing here is that abuse is ignored and accepted exactly because of that depending on race. It offends Raggatwin and many on here when non white British people are spoken about in any negative form and creates an atmosphere of fear, exactly why the abusers in Rotherham were allowed to ruin the lives of over 1,400 children. And yet all anybody can say or do is to try and hush me and tell me I have no right to an opinion on it or am some kind of racist. Oh the irony!

This forum is an excellent example of Britain today. A Britain controlled by fear. And what a sad state of affairs it is too. And so we are going to have some new rules here now are we? Freedom of speech and expression used to be all about what my country was all about. But clearly not now. How utterly ridiculous and pathetic. Some people have totally lost their grip. I would also say that if I have no right to speak of what I want then the whole off topic section should be closed down. It is either freedom of speech for all or none at all. Or am I wrong?

[GalataPSB]

Jsdouvres is here.it means , the topic will be locked very soon!

[Your Funny Uncle]

This is a privately owned and run forum. The admins have the right to do whatever the hell they want. It's quite like a pub, in that respect. Yes it's a public house, and the idea is that people come in and drink/chat, but the Landlord can bar you if you are seen to be disruptive. Equally, if the landlord pisses enough people off with draconian treatment of customers, then they will stop going to the pub and look elsewhere. The difference here of course is that "customers" don't pay anything and the admins don't earn any money from running this place.

If you want freedom of speech, go make your own website. It's easy. No-one is stopping you.

[Patrick Bateman]

[raggatwin]

Thought I'd open a topic about the upcoming forum changes. Now what could they possibly be?

I'm thinking that they will involve banning freedom of speech because lately it has been a big issue for certain users of this forum.

My big question though is as follows: If a topic does not interest you or even offends you then do we all have the right to get that topic closed down? There are a hell of a lot of people on here who have a massive problem discussing things which although pretty important and very real, involve topics which are very scary indeed. Should fear be the winner here of is freedom of speech more important?

I have seen a user on this very website openly support violence, segregation and hatred but once again because of fear people refuse to speak out and in fact choose to speak out at ME for daring to talk about things in the first place!!!!

This is the off topic section of a website, meaning that in a free society (which we used to live in) we have the right to discuss what we want. And if you do not like the topic and do not want to read about it or comment about it then common sense should take over and you should ignore it. Yes, common sense.

Does anybody wonder why the terrible events like in Rotherham (oh my God, I must have offended somebody, no idea how though!) actually happen? The simple answer is because of the exact attitudes seen on this very website. It is a cancer in our society that spreads like wildfire and will end with the riots as predicted by Enoch Powell which is a tragedy. This country has allowed scum like the EDL and BNP to hijack what should be acceptable and supported opposition into things like extremism (without question we should oppose it) which because supported by them is now seen as a big no no and something we should all be quiet about. That is also a real tragedy. I feel that people in Britain now have the attitude that certain parts of society are untouchable which is truly shocking and incredibly unjust. Just look at the reaction to me? And the reason? Because I talk about things that make people feel uncomfortable so I therefore must be a racist? Absolutely pathetic. Until the day when we can all talk about everybody equally people in this country will always be at odds with each other which can only be a bad thing. Raggatwin confirmed everything when he posted that he was going to give the stats for sexual assaults on children by race in Britain. For very obvious reasons. He proved that to him that is what this is about when of course the main thing here is that abuse is ignored and accepted exactly because of that depending on race. It offends Raggatwin and many on here when non white British people are spoken about in any negative form and creates an atmosphere of fear, exactly why the abusers in Rotherham were allowed to ruin the lives of over 1,400 children. And yet all anybody can say or do is to try and hush me and tell me I have no right to an opinion on it or am some kind of racist. Oh the irony!

This forum is an excellent example of Britain today. A Britain controlled by fear. And what a sad state of affairs it is too. And so we are going to have some new rules here now are we? Freedom of speech and expression used to be all about what my country was all about. But clearly not now. How utterly ridiculous and pathetic. Some people have totally lost their grip. I would also say that if I have no right to speak of what I want then the whole off topic section should be closed down. It is either freedom of speech for all or none at all. Or am I wrong?

1. I wrote stats by ethnicity not 'race'.
2. I've not seen you refer to 'white British' child abusers so therefore had to infer that the people you were referring to were not 'white British'.

[Undertaker]

From what I've read over the past 6 months or so hasn't a lot to do with subjects as such, it just quickly escalates in members throwing accusations at each other.

I'm pretty sure nobody is avoiding talking about the matters arising, it's the tantrums that soon follow and the way some members are spoken to when they don't agree.

Most of us have done it but fooking hell fire, lately its been more relentless than the white lion radio topics.

[raggatwin]

From what I've read over the past 6 months or so hasn't a lot to do with subjects as such, it just quickly escalates in members throwing accusations at each other.

I'm pretty sure nobody is avoiding talking about the matters arising, it's the tantrums that soon follow and the way some members are spoken to when they don't agree.

Most of us have done it but fooking hell fire, lately its been more relentless than the white lion radio topics.

LOL. That last line is very funny.

[JSDOUVRES]

Thought I'd open a topic about the upcoming forum changes. Now what could they possibly be?

I'm thinking that they will involve banning freedom of speech because lately it has been a big issue for certain users of this forum.

My big question though is as follows: If a topic does not interest you or even offends you then do we all have the right to get that topic closed down? There are a hell of a lot of people on here who have a massive problem discussing things which although pretty important and very real, involve topics which are very scary indeed. Should fear be the winner here of is freedom of speech more important?

I have seen a user on this very website openly support violence, segregation and hatred but once again because of fear people refuse to speak out and in fact choose to speak out at ME for daring to talk about things in the first place!!!!

This is the off topic section of a website, meaning that in a free society (which we used to live in) we have the right to discuss what we want. And if you do not like the topic and do not want to read about it or comment about it then common sense should take over and you should ignore it. Yes, common sense.

Does anybody wonder why the terrible events like in Rotherham (oh my God, I must have offended somebody, no idea how though!) actually happen? The simple answer is because of the exact attitudes seen on this very website. It is a cancer in our society that spreads like wildfire and will end with the riots as predicted by Enoch Powell which is a tragedy. This country has allowed scum like the EDL and BNP to hijack what should be acceptable and supported opposition into things like extremism (without question we should oppose it) which because supported by them is now seen as a big no no and something we should all be quiet about. That is also a real tragedy. I feel that people in Britain now have the attitude that certain parts of society are untouchable which is truly shocking and incredibly unjust. Just look at the reaction to me? And the reason? Because I talk about things that make people feel uncomfortable so I therefore must be a racist? Absolutely pathetic. Until the day when we can all talk about everybody equally people in this country will always be at odds with each other which can only be a bad thing. Raggatwin confirmed everything when he posted that he was going to give the stats for sexual assaults on children by race in Britain. For very obvious reasons. He proved that to him that is what this is about when of course the main thing here is that abuse is ignored and accepted exactly because of that depending on race. It offends Raggatwin and many on here when non white British people are spoken about in any negative form and creates an atmosphere of fear, exactly why the abusers in Rotherham were allowed to ruin the lives of over 1,400 children. And yet all anybody can say or do is to try and hush me and tell me I have no right to an opinion on it or am some kind of racist. Oh the irony!

This forum is an excellent example of Britain today. A Britain controlled by fear. And what a sad state of affairs it is too. And so we are going to have some new rules here now are we? Freedom of speech and expression used to be all about what my country was all about. But clearly not now. How utterly ridiculous and pathetic. Some people have totally lost their grip. I would also say that if I have no right to speak of what I want then the whole off topic section should be closed down. It is either freedom of speech for all or none at all. Or am I wrong?

1. I wrote stats by ethnicity not 'race'.
2. I've not seen you refer to 'white British' child abusers so therefore had to infer that the people you were referring to were not 'white British'.

No wonder the abuse of children was allowed to continue in Rotherham, authorities there share exactly your mindset with an obsession on the ethnicity or race (whatever pleases you) of the abusers and in this case them not being white British which is obviously a HUGE problem for a lot of people like yourself. It is incredibly ironic that even here on this forum it is seen as a big no no subject because of exactly that. How about actually admitting that there is a huge problem with people fearing (you can see why with me) being called racist when it is absolutely not the point in question at all and has caused over a thousand children to be viciously abused in a way which is absolutely disgusting and sick with even the abusers knowing they were safe because of the race game loved by many on here.

We should be able to discuss this and ways to make sure that ethnicity is not an issue when it comes to such things because with all the abuse that is known about all over the country it is a massive problem which warrants being discussed by all that want to.

My obvious point in all this was that the abusers were being protected because of the fear of the authorities of being labelled racist (obvious here why that is), that should have been obvious but obviously I am racist by making that exact point.......

[JSDOUVRES]

From what I've read over the past 6 months or so hasn't a lot to do with subjects as such, it just quickly escalates in members throwing accusations at each other.

I'm pretty sure nobody is avoiding talking about the matters arising, it's the tantrums that soon follow and the way some members are spoken to when they don't agree.

Most of us have done it but fooking hell fire, lately its been more relentless than the white lion radio topics.

LOL. That last line is very funny.

You are wrong, people are purposely causing arguments to avoid the matters arising as they find the matters arising "uncomfortable" just as the authorities in Rotherham and all over the UK have done which has lead to rampant abuse of innocent children which is shocking but not to some it seems, that is plainly obvious. The arguments that follow such attempts at discussion are always about the fact that people do not want to talk about certain matters for fear of being labelled racist and this is always a major factor when trying to discuss such matters. Raggatwin proves it as all he can do is attempt to post stats about convicted abusers by ethnicity. He is scared of offending by admitting that what we have here is a real problem based on the fear of being labelled exactly what he fears about being labelled. It is quite a funny circle of events actually which I think people are actually unaware of because we have been taught that telling the truth about minority groups is unacceptable when it absolutely is not. 9 yes 9 men have been convicted in Rotherham! That is it! If this abuse was carried out by groups of White British men then this number would be in the hundreds and that really is what we have to deal with these days. No doubt you will see me as racist for making this point, you are programmed to so don't worry about it. To me this is an incredibly serious situation, just like the Jimmy Saville thing was, he got away with it out of fear too let's not forget because he too was seen as untouchable, not by his ethnicity but by his status which is equally disgusting.

[dynamobjornen]

Freedom of speech? This is by far the most tolerent forum I have ever been a member of. But when political topics constantly ends up in arguments and insults it's not much point in them is there?

[StevePSB]

Freedom of speech? This is by far the most tolerent forum I have ever been a member of. But when political topics constantly ends up in arguments and insults it's not much point in them is there?

Thank you dynamobjornen.

We really don't like to be heavy handed in the running of the forum and 99% of the time we don't have to be, but from time to time we are lead to the actions we end up having to take. These kinds of topics and arguments have gone on for years, and we've done our best to allow them to continue. Of late they're constant, always cause arguments (and those posting the threads know this full well before they even start) and are beginning to poison the forum.

As I have said before, we've had to tweak the rules once before to deal with other users on other issues when the forum was being abused and people were getting upset. We have no wish to stifle free speech, but at the end of the day, as alluded to by YFU, this forum is not a democracy it is privately owned and run with a small set of rules which really don't ask much of the members, and it's there for the pleasure of all, not a small handful who won't take a polite hint or request made time and again over a period of (literally) years.

There comes a point where we can no longer stand and watch the forum spoilt for the majority because of certain posts from two, three or four members out of 1500+ registered here. If it takes another tweak of the rules (which those same 1500+ will have no issues with whatsoever) to get a grip on the issue, then that's what has to happen. Our hand has been forced and we now have to act. I'm truly sorry about that, but after such a long time beating the same drum to no avail we feel there's now nowhere else to turn.



StevePSB

[Patrick Bateman]

Coincidentally enough, the word whomp game was always popular within Rotherham Children's Services.

[gregf]

It is sad that we cannot discuss interesting "political" topics.

I think part of the problem is the nature of forums and the net.

Effectively one reactionary person can shout down 10 rational people.
And that is a free speech problem.

It may be possible to fix by disabling the ability to quote another person,
or to limit the size of some peoples posts, or both.

Looking into phpBB options ...

[Danny C]

No wonder the abuse of children was allowed to continue in Rotherham, authorities there share exactly your mindset with an obsession on the ethnicity or race (whatever pleases you) of the abusers and in this case them not being white British which is obviously a HUGE problem for a lot of people like yourself.

And here we go again, with JSDOUVRES personalising the discussion by attacking other members instead of just discussing the issue. A perfect example of why the threads descend into flame wars - a very few people (and it is just one or two) are unable to play the ball without playing the man.

It doesn't need heavy handed moderation. Just clamp down on the unnecessary personal attacks and the threads will never get out of hand. Very, very simple.

[JSDOUVRES]

No wonder the abuse of children was allowed to continue in Rotherham, authorities there share exactly your mindset with an obsession on the ethnicity or race (whatever pleases you) of the abusers and in this case them not being white British which is obviously a HUGE problem for a lot of people like yourself.

And here we go again, with JSDOUVRES personalising the discussion by attacking other members instead of just discussing the issue. A perfect example of why the threads descend into flame wars - a very few people (and it is just one or two) are unable to play the ball without playing the man.

It doesn't need heavy handed moderation. Just clamp down on the unnecessary personal attacks and the threads will never get out of hand. Very, very simple.

I believe that it is an excellent point actually about what fear does to people and is not an attack on other members. The views shared on here show that a lot of people see things such as crimes carried out by ethnic minorities as big taboo subjects which is exactly what has happened in Rotherham and many other parts of the country, a taboo shared by a lot of people in this country and of which needs to stopped in order to crack down on these horrific crimes, and they are horrific as anybody whom has followed these stories would know (Been the headline story on all news channels on UK TV the past few days). I have a right to this opinion and people's replies to me on this forum support and back up my views a great deal it has to be said. A woman interviewed on the BBC last night said she saw young girls being approached by older Asian men in cars but felt she could not speak up for fear of being seen as racist, if the older men were white she would have had no problem to speak up at all about it which shows that society has an enormous problem due to fear and that these poor children are the victims because of it. Sorry if me speaking the plain truth offends people, but we should be able to speak up about these things without fear which is still a long way off it seems.