NEIL IS BACK!

[JSDOUVRES]

Some here seen to think Great Britain is still an empire ruling the world. I hated seeing the country vote in favour of Brexit, but now the consequences must be dealt with. The UK (basically England) will be an island (literally) with hardly any industry or services they export (apart from entertainment and academia). The financial success of London is based on the EU. The UK will become what they were in the early 80s again, a noncompeting economy with nostalgia for the past. Sad but true. There are no benefits for EU, so why should ‘we’ (I am from the EU) give in to the wishes of a country that wants to leave?

Total and utter nonsense! The success of Britain, financial and more is not based on use being a member of the European Union! Although I would suggest that the economic failures of countries such as Greece, Spain, Italy and soon to be France may well be down to that!

And what do you mean exactly by the EU giving in to the wishes of a country that wants to leave? Are you saying that you believe that the EU has some divine right to rule over us and if we refuse then you wish us to fail and want to 'punish' us for doing so and want us to fail? At least you are being honest I suppose.... What a strange and ridiculous thing to say. And it is quite ironic you speak of Great Britain being an empire wanting to rule the world, I would say that the European Union is trying to do exactly that to us whereas Britain wishes to be an independent country making it's own decisions, trading and working with the world's economies on it's own terms and having full power and sovereignty to decide it's own future, quite how you have come to the conclusion that Britain therefore wants to somehow rule the world again due to that is frankly beyond me and is as ridiculous as it is stupid as it sounds but then again I imagine that as a European you are running scared of our success and the end of our massive contributions propping up the failing and authoritarian EU regime.

Your post sums up everything that is wrong with the current EU and the fact you don't see that says a lot more about yourself than anything else to be honest. I'd love to know where you are from, would make me laugh I'm sure! You forgot to mention the Nazi's in your post though, try not to forget that next time and good luck in the EU without us and our money, I'm sure it will be a blast for you and I make no apologies for being patriotic (or nostalgic as you would like to believe as I'm English and what right do I have to love my country hey?!) and of having nothing but utter contempt for the EU which has been justified time and time again during the disgraceful way they have conducted themselves during the negotiations.

A good deal would obviously benefit everybody but there are some that do not want to relinquish control and are clearly fearful of us being the success we will be rather than wanting the best for all involved. I can't wait for us to leave and finally be left to our own devices.

[JSDOUVRES]

It all depends on your political viewpoint. EU is not about federalism, but about peace and stability in Europe. GB (minus Scotland that is, because they are not happy about Brexit and will pay double the price of England and Wales) may nowadays only occupy only parts of Spain and Ireland, they still feel they are the centre of the Commonwealth of nations.

More people in Scotland voted for Britain to leave the EU than for the SNP to get into power and not just that but the people of Scotland knew there would be a vote on EU membership before their vote to remain part of the UK and a majority decided to remain so please don't talk nonsense as you simply do not know what you are talking about.

It makes me laugh too to hear you speak of peace and stability, like that is under threat unless we are a member of the EU! Are you serious? I sincerely hope not!

Where are you from? I'd love to know and am sure it would make me laugh!

[jasonjohn]

If Brexit happens, it’s almost certain Scotland will leave the UK and take its resources with it into the European Union

The “United Kingdon” would cast quite a lonely, pathetic shadow after that.

That’s how this ends!!!!

[jasonjohn]

Seriously, any isolationist argument you have for the UK to leave the EU just doubles the motivation for Scotland leaving the UK

[jasonjohn]

More people in Scotland voted for Britain to leave the EU than for the SNP to get into power and not just that but the people of Scotland knew there would be a vote on EU membership before their vote to remain part of the UK and a majority decided to remain so please don't talk nonsense as you simply do not know what you are talking about.

Before you accuse people of not knowing what they are talking about - you need to be damned sure Scotland voted that way not as a means to later give momentum to them leaving the UK

[MD]

Very predictable although I do hope this isn’t the first sign of dementia. That would be a shame for someone so undeniably intelligent.

Perhaps someone needs to remind Neil. There was a people’s vote

Remain lost.

We leave the EU

Let’s move on

True, but the ‘people’ are fickle and can hold as many votes as they want. And since, in a democracy, the people are God they can change their mind when ever they so choose. The tyranny of the majority is only as strong as the latest poll/vote. Democracy is a double edge sword that cuts both ways. There is no right or wrong only the will of the sovereign people. We must not forget that the stupid/ignorant/dull also have the right to vote. Hell, millions of Germans actually voted for the Nazis.

Here we go again! 'millions of people voted for the Nazis'. Comparing Brexit to the Nazis!!!!! You just can't make this shit up! I suggest you do some research on history and maybe you will learn that it really is quite offensive, ridiculous and absolutely outrageous to try and use the Nazis as a way to justify some kind of disdain for democracy when things like Brexit doesn't go the way you or others wanted it to.

And yes, there are plenty of stupid/ignorant and dull people out there. The kind of people that reference the Nazis when democracy doesn't go their way for example. Pathetic. I do agree though that people have every right to change their mind and opinion on things. The simple fact of the matter though is that Brexit has not happened yet so you can hardly overturn a decision made that hasn't even been implemented now can you???

Democracy is not something that only applies when it goes the way you want it to. Sadly there are many people in this great country that choose to ignore that and are willing to use all kinds of tactics in order to try and back themselves up. Utter disgrace.

I’m sorry, you seem to have misunderstood me. I was referring to your statement that there had been “a People’s vote“ and that, in your opinion, that made the issue settled. I’m afraid that this simply is not the case. In a democracy “the people“ are the absolute rulers of their nations destiny. They can, if It pleases them, hold one, two or a hundred votes on any issue. It makes no difference what you or I think, the “people” in a democracy are god and there is no political, legal or moral force that can stop them from exercising this Sovereign power as and when they so desire. However, like the kings of old , they will have to live with the consequences.

With regard to the Nazis, I was simply pointing out that “ the people “ sometimes make the most stupid/Dull/ignorant choices. You see, winning a vote or election does not make you right or wrong it simply makes you victorious. You also seem to believe that I voted for remain, you are wrong. I sincerely hope that “ The people ” have made the right choice and that Brexit will not lay waste to the united kingdom’s economic and social fabric. In either case, we will find out a few years down the road.

[oakey]

Can this thread be moved to off topic please? Discussions like these never lead to any individuals changing their own standpoint and belong underneath items on the BBC News website where it's easy to ignore them.

Thanks.

It’s Neil who started the discussion
But you are in fact correct. I will refrain from commenting any further apart on the music of PSB.

[JSDOUVRES]

Can this thread be moved to off topic please? Discussions like these never lead to any individuals changing their own standpoint and belong underneath items on the BBC News website where it's easy to ignore them.

Thanks.

It’s Neil who started the discussion
But you are in fact correct. I will refrain from commenting any further apart on the music of PSB.

What a shame, I thought for a second you had a pair of balls there but how wrong I was! You are happy to dish out all kinds of nonsense and bile but are clearly unable to defend yourself once challenged over it. Clearly 'made in the EU' and A clear case of 'I made my excuses and left'.

Worried the EU will fail miserably once we leave? It's already on that route so at least you can use us as an excuse to helping it on it's way. Would still love to know where you are from but I can see that you don't want to admit that which in itself says enough, I can promise you though (and I have seen that it is a worry for you on some of your other posts) that the 'British Empire' will not be trying to conquer and control your country (à la EU) so please don't worry about that. Who knows, if we get down on our knees and beg hard enough with you we may even be able to continue trading with you on friendly terms, but I know that is probably asking a bit too much.....

I love Europe but detest the European Union which is and has proved itself time and time again that it is power hungry and vengeful to those that refuse to bow down to it and follow it's rules! Can't wait until we are finally out and expect many others to follow suit.

[JSDOUVRES]

It’s Neil who started the discussion
But you are in fact correct. I will refrain from commenting any further apart on the music of PSB.

So it seems you are from Holland according to previous posts.
The heroic country that declared itself 'neutral' in both world wars but in WW2 was invaded by Germany anyway but did manage to defend itself for 4 days at least. And which country was it that the Dutch government and Royal family went to for refuge? Ahhh, Yes, you've guessed it, England! Now why would they have dared to ever do such a thing?
Some countries and it's people like to control their our destinies and believe in self-rule and full sovereignty, others are submissive and weak and like to follow the lead of others. Seems like you and your country have not learned the lessons from the past and you are now even using them against the UK which is incredibly sad and quite pathetic to be honest. Good luck under EU rule, I suppose there are some that need to be lead, that is certainly not not the case for the UK and maybe one day you will learn to respect that as difficult as that may be.

[Future Lover]

The quotes look like black walls, indistinguishable from the black walls some of you are building with your words. This topic should be closed or renamed, since it's an inflammatory piece of crap. I'm someone from outside both the EU and UK and I don't care about your quarrels. To me, Brexit is just a piece of a global puzzle that implies that neoliberal capitalism is slowly crumbling. Also, nationalism is an outdated concept that's a easy-to-use tool to manipulate people when other things around them are failing.

[daveid]

I am no longer able to follow threads on this forum due to the f*** speech marks blotting out every quote. It's ridiculous. I told The Gardner but clearly the fix hasn't worked. It's been ages now. Has anyone else reported this in the support section? Im on the verge of quitting if this carries on much longer.

[oakey]

I am no longer able to follow threads on this forum due to the f****** speech marks blotting out every quote. It's ridiculous. I told The Gardner but clearly the fix hasn't worked. It's been ages now. Has anyone else reported this in the support section? Im on the verge of quitting if this carries on much longer.

I don't have this issue on my PC but on my iPad and iPhone it is indeed impossible to follow threads because of this.

[oakey]

It’s Neil who started the discussion
But you are in fact correct. I will refrain from commenting any further apart on the music of PSB.

So it seems you are from Holland according to previous posts.
The heroic country that declared itself 'neutral' in both world wars but in WW2 was invaded by Germany anyway but did manage to defend itself for 4 days at least. And which country was it that the Dutch government and Royal family went to for refuge? Ahhh, Yes, you've guessed it, England! Now why would they have dared to ever do such a thing?
Some countries and it's people like to control their our destinies and believe in self-rule and full sovereignty, others are submissive and weak and like to follow the lead of others. Seems like you and your country have not learned the lessons from the past and you are now even using them against the UK which is incredibly sad and quite pathetic to be honest. Good luck under EU rule, I suppose there are some that need to be lead, that is certainly not not the case for the UK and maybe one day you will learn to respect that as difficult as that may be.

Sorry this is too hard to resist.
You know this was almost 80 years ago right. When the King was Emperor of India. Illustrating my point of a country living in the past.

BTW Holland is not a country.

[Neilatrone]

It’s Neil who started the discussion
But you are in fact correct. I will refrain from commenting any further apart on the music of PSB.

So it seems you are from Holland according to previous posts.
The heroic country that declared itself 'neutral' in both world wars but in WW2 was invaded by Germany anyway but did manage to defend itself for 4 days at least. And which country was it that the Dutch government and Royal family went to for refuge? Ahhh, Yes, you've guessed it, England! Now why would they have dared to ever do such a thing?
Some countries and it's people like to control their our destinies and believe in self-rule and full sovereignty, others are submissive and weak and like to follow the lead of others. Seems like you and your country have not learned the lessons from the past and you are now even using them against the UK which is incredibly sad and quite pathetic to be honest. Good luck under EU rule, I suppose there are some that need to be lead, that is certainly not not the case for the UK and maybe one day you will learn to respect that as difficult as that may be.

Sorry this is too hard to resist.
You know this was almost 80 years ago right. When the King was Emperor of India. Illustrating my point of a country living in the past.

BTW Holland is not a country.

Sorry to jump in, but you don’t need to defend yourself (or “Holland” or the EU) against such posts.

Sensible people can identify provocative language and appreciate the overall context of Brexit.

Eventually, time will tell what the consequences will be for the UK, deal or no-deal. Now back to everyday life.

[JSDOUVRES]

It’s Neil who started the discussion
But you are in fact correct. I will refrain from commenting any further apart on the music of PSB.

So it seems you are from Holland according to previous posts.
The heroic country that declared itself 'neutral' in both world wars but in WW2 was invaded by Germany anyway but did manage to defend itself for 4 days at least. And which country was it that the Dutch government and Royal family went to for refuge? Ahhh, Yes, you've guessed it, England! Now why would they have dared to ever do such a thing?
Some countries and it's people like to control their our destinies and believe in self-rule and full sovereignty, others are submissive and weak and like to follow the lead of others. Seems like you and your country have not learned the lessons from the past and you are now even using them against the UK which is incredibly sad and quite pathetic to be honest. Good luck under EU rule, I suppose there are some that need to be lead, that is certainly not not the case for the UK and maybe one day you will learn to respect that as difficult as that may be.

Sorry this is too hard to resist.
You know this was almost 80 years ago right. When the King was Emperor of India. Illustrating my point of a country living in the past.

BTW Holland is not a country.

Sorry, I obviously meant The Netherlands, my mistake... Yes, you are correct that it was almost 80 years ago but it doesn't change the fact that it happened and is a part of history, just as the British Empire 'ruling the world' is too which you yourself felt inclined to mention. Sorry but you can't try and quote history as a pathetic way of trying to justifying something then rebuke it when it is thrown back at you. Clearly 'The Netherlands' enjoys being Germany's puppet and good on you, Great Britain, on the other hand, does not and the people have said and voted as such so please get over it rather than making this out to be something it is not.