Pet Shop Boys Community

I highly respect your contribution to this forum, Drico, but this discussion simply isn’t on-topic. It’s just not.

I’ll just leave it as that and won’t ever visit this threat again. Enjoy.

m+

Nickname wrote: Sun 24 Mar 2024, 12:36 am I know it could be on the off topic section but it was posted by PSB on their official account.

I wrote this in the first post of this thread and I understand the debate about it.

But you should bear in mind Neil and Chris are part of this world like any of us and they also want to express their opinions about some aspects of the real world and also political issues. When they send these messages on the official Twitter account is just because the want fans to know not only their thoughts about them but also to give adittional info about that particular topic.

As they say: "we have played in the Crocus City Hall". They could have been there, terrorists could have killed them. They are humans. We have a country that wants to destroy Europe.

Lord, help us all. I pray for all of you. I pray for the war to end.
Islamic terrorists don't care who they kill.
By the way, the FSB found out that ISIS is preparing terrorist attacks in Germany, Finland and somewhere else. The US has warned Russia because even though the US and Russia are enemies now. Paradoxically, Russia and the US are fighting ISIS in the Middle East. It's just a paradox. Moreover Russia and the US are flying into space together. This is also a paradox.

Parkol wrote: Sun 24 Mar 2024, 4:52 pm Lord, help us all. I pray for all of you. I pray for the war to end.
Islamic terrorists don't care who they kill.
By the way, the FSB found out that ISIS is preparing terrorist attacks in Germany, Finland and somewhere else. The US has warned Russia because even though the US and Russia are enemies now. Paradoxically, Russia and the US are fighting ISIS in the Middle East. It's just a paradox. Moreover Russia and the US are flying into space together. This is also a paradox.

It's not a paradox at all if you scroll through world history.
Although I doubt that FSB these days can find anything but some gay communities to incarcerate and persecute.

telys wrote: Sun 24 Mar 2024, 1:07 pm I find it perplexing that fans find the ideological stances of PSB irritating. It's not as if Neil or Chris have been hiding them. They take stances on many issues: gay rights (I agree), rock music (I don't agree), state of modern pop music (I both agree and don't agree), trumpism (I agree with them), putinism (I agree), merchandise (I don't agree). Anyway, as long as they don't go completely bollocks I have nothing against them. Their first single was extremely political and their 2nd album as well. Now, they're older and can express whatever they want whenever they want. Anyway, there shouldn't be anything to critizise in Neil's latest tweet.

What is their stance on merchandise? I don’t recall ever hearing anything about this.

Drico One wrote: Sun 24 Mar 2024, 12:56 pm
Who is letting the "finger wavers" have their way? This thread is indisputably on-topic - until it isn't. I agree with you - if people think it should be off-topic they can choose to avoid it. By the same token, if the thread starts to get used for aspects of this issue that go way beyond the fact that PSBs tweeted about an incident in Moscow - or for other agendas - then a different call might need to be made. In the end, you'd hope people would engage with the thread in a reasonably sensitive way. But we won't shut it down for simply being "political".

Thanks for your moderation Drico. If the similar topics keeps coming up maybe this thread could be renamed and used as a catch-all.

Nickname wrote: Sun 24 Mar 2024, 3:47 pm

As they say: "we have played in the Crocus City Hall". They could have been there, terrorists could have killed them. They are humans. We have a country that wants to destroy Europe.

Isn't Islamic State more of a Jihadi death cult, rather than a country?

Surprisingly, one of the terrorists worked in a hairdresser's shop, never been seen anywhere in particular. Married with children. He travelled to Turkey, received training there, and then, as if nothing had happened, just started killing everyone indiscriminately. Citizens of other countries were killed too.

About gays in Russia and their persecution.
Honestly, on our Russian TV the most popular programmes are hosted by gays and nobody cares. So, believe the propaganda less. Islamic republics are strict with it, and there are a lot of them on TV. In cinema, in theatre, music.

Now all the media are trying not to aggravate the national and religious issue, but people are still boiling. They say, stop tolerating it, kick the migrants out. It is easier to prevent such situations, but it is not the people who make decisions, but the authorities.

And yes, move this topic to the off-topic, please.

God bless everyone and stop the war.

Patrick Bateman wrote: Mon 25 Mar 2024, 7:12 am

Nickname wrote: Sun 24 Mar 2024, 3:47 pm

As they say: "we have played in the Crocus City Hall". They could have been there, terrorists could have killed them. They are humans. We have a country that wants to destroy Europe.

Isn't Islamic State more of a Jihadi death cult, rather than a country?

Nickname is most probably refering to Russia.

Parkol wrote: Mon 25 Mar 2024, 2:01 pm Surprisingly, one of the terrorists worked in a hairdresser's shop, never been seen anywhere in particular. Married with children. He travelled to Turkey, received training there, and then, as if nothing had happened, just started killing everyone indiscriminately. Citizens of other countries were killed too.

About gays in Russia and their persecution.
Honestly, on our Russian TV the most popular programmes are hosted by gays and nobody cares. So, believe the propaganda less.

Don't worry, I don't think anyone here believe Russian propaganda at all.

Parkol wrote: Mon 25 Mar 2024, 2:01 pm Surprisingly, one of the terrorists worked in a hairdresser's shop, never been seen anywhere in particular. Married with children. He travelled to Turkey, received training there, and then, as if nothing had happened, just started killing everyone indiscriminately. Citizens of other countries were killed too.

About gays in Russia and their persecution.
Honestly, on our Russian TV the most popular programmes are hosted by gays and nobody cares. So, believe the propaganda less. Islamic republics are strict with it, and there are a lot of them on TV. In cinema, in theatre, music.

The attack poses a dilemma, frequent in the West, for liberals like Neil. Putin's your bogeyman, so what happens when Putin's country is attacked by other (anti-gay, anti-democratic) forces? It's one they have yet to resolve.

Parkol wrote: Mon 25 Mar 2024, 2:01 pm
About gays in Russia and their persecution.
Honestly, on our Russian TV the most popular programmes are hosted by gays and nobody cares. So, believe the propaganda less.

The acceptance of some „gay“ individuals in the media does not necessarily reflect broader societal acceptance or the absence of discrimination.

Just a few examples of discrimination against homosexuals in Russia:

Labeling of LGBTQ+ as ‘Extremist’: In 2023, the LGBTQ+ movement in Russia was declared “extremist,” equating being LGBTQ+ with participating in an extremist organization, a criminal offense.

Gay Propaganda Law: Enacted in 2013, this law bans the “promotion of nontraditional sexual relations to minors,” effectively limiting access to information and support for LGBTQ+ youth.

Vigilante Violence: The passage of the gay propaganda law has coincided with an increase in vigilante violence against LGBTQ+ individuals.

Denial of Rights: LGBTQ+ youth face barriers to their rights to dignity, health, education, information, and association due to widespread discrimination.

Political Homophobia: Russian officials have used homophobic rhetoric for political gain, branding LGBTQ+ people as threats to traditional values.

Social Stigma: The absence of open dialogue following the decriminalization of homosexuality in 1993 allowed entrenched homophobia to persist.

Hate Speech: High levels of government have engaged in negative portrayals and hate speech against the LGBTQ+ community.

Censorship: Mental health professionals have reported self-censoring to avoid running afoul of the gay propaganda law.

False Accusations: LGBTQ+ people have been accused of “spreading HIV infection, moral vices, and the destruction of the nation” without evidence.

Lack of Support Services: The gay propaganda law has led to the shutdown of websites and barred LGBT support groups from working with youth.

And so on…

https://theconversation.com/30-years-of ... 023-220569

https://www.hrw.org/report/2018/12/12/n ... lgbt-youth

Parkol wrote: Mon 25 Mar 2024, 2:01 pm So, believe the propaganda less.

It seems like a scene out of Monty Python: Someone who is constantly exposed to propaganda in their own country warns others not to believe the alleged propaganda in their countries.

Patrick Bateman wrote: Mon 25 Mar 2024, 3:33 pmThe attack poses a dilemma, frequent in the West, for liberals like Neil. Putin's your bogeyman, so what happens when Putin's country is attacked by other (anti-gay, anti-democratic) forces?

There is no dilemma. The terrorist attack is abhorrent. Putin's regime is abhorrent. Neither can - or should - be defended.