Pet Shop Boys Community

Tomas wrote:But what if it simply applies the language (and enthusiasm) of asylum seeker to describe the procedure from their point of view, full stop?

(The asylum seeker's clumsy language saying "you're my nation" - I assume only a primary school native English pupil would speak like this, but I can imagine someone from Sri Lanka can express themselves this way.)

"Seeing you here, you're my nation." is the full lyric. That's a pesronal lyric.Your interpretation would require someone who was extremely bad at English, and that wouldn't fit the rest of the song's lyrics, which are perfectly intelligible.

Your Funny Uncle wrote:"Seeing you here, you're my nation." is the full lyric. That's a pesronal lyric.

Not necessarily. "You" could easily refer to the British. It's idiotic to suggest that the song is solely a metaphor; it's not solely anything and the language used is very much intended to make the listener sympathize with asylum seekers.

yeah, I thought it was written like the fugitive.only from the point of view of the immigrants. they already consider the place they want to live their home.they just want it declared so legally.and thats what they are waiting for, something official.

patrick wrote: Not necessarily. "You" could easily refer to the British. It's idiotic to suggest that the song is solely a metaphor; it's not solely anything and the language used is very much intended to make the listener sympathize with asylum seekers.

In the end, I guess you can read the song in both ways, but personally it stretches my credulity to see it is a song actually by an asylum seeker. No need be accusing me of idiocy, though. It's all just opinion... I did say I think wayne is right, I never said it was a fact. Everyone is entitled to their own reading of a song. I thought we were just discussing, not name calling.

It hadn't actually occurred to me that the song could be a love song from an asylum seeker to the UK as a whole. I had only really focussed on the personal nature of the lyric and on the asylum issue / language as a metaphor for the struggle to establish oneself in a relationship. I wil listen to the song with fresh ears on the next time I hear it!

Your Funny Uncle wrote:In the end, I guess you can read the song in both ways, but personally it stretches my credulity to see it is a song actually by an asylum seeker.

Aside from the fact that the lyrics don't actually support your argument, of course. The metaphor is so incredibly tortured that we're obviously meant to consider the track on multiple levels.

I thought we were just discussing, not name calling.

I didn't call anyone a name.

raggatwin wrote:I think millionaire liberals should steer clear of comenting on the immigration and asylum act.......

I disagree! IMO it's all bollocks anyway. Who has any right to actually 'belong' in a country? For instance, multimillionaire Indian businessmen were always extremely welcome in New Labour's Britain.

Love this track - very touching.

It's about this man:

http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2006240168,00.html

patrick wrote:
Aside from the fact that the lyrics don't actually support your argument, of course.

Strange, because from where I'm standing they don't support yours. If find the metaphor to be entirely consistant throughout the song and hence not tortured in the slightest. A man has wandered the world, but returns to his true love, and wats the chance to have a go at a long term relationship. The request is couched in the terms of an application for a residency permit.

The lyrics and the entire mood of the song seem to personal to me to take it as other than a love song. Of course it has a topical twist, which is designed to make us think of immigrants. I just can't go the extra mile to see it as actually a love song to a nation. I see it as a personal love song with the twist of a topical metaphor.

Anyway, whatever Neil's intention, I guess this argument proves that even the simplest of songs is open to multiple interpretations, and that's really what makes art great, isn't it?

I find the undercurrent of anti-immigrant feeling that pervades this forum slightly disconcerting at times. There seems to be a notion that it is somehow unnatural to feel sympathy towards people looking for a better life. Horizons are there to be broadened.

As for the song, I think the metaphor is a little forced.

Drico.

Well one thing I'm certainly not is anti-immigrant, especially as my wife will be applying for the titular visa later this year...

Your Funny Uncle wrote:Strange, because from where I'm standing they don't support yours.

That's because you're not actually paying attention to them. Never heard of Occam's Razor I suppose. The song works on a literal level. It also works on a metaphorical level. Where you're wrong is insisting that it only works on a metaphorical level and has nothing to say about its literal subject.

If find the metaphor to be entirely consistant throughout the song and hence not tortured in the slightest.

The metaphor itself is tortured. Have you ever heard anyone talk like that? Of course not. This is because it's ridiculously overwrought. So ridiculously overwrought, in fact, that we are obviously meant to consider the literal meaning as well. And that shouldn't be a surprise to anyone. On a literal level it's doing exactly the same thing London is doing. We're clearly meant to sympathize with the immigrant position because of the way the song is phrased; who sides against hope?

The lyrics and the entire mood of the song seem to personal to me to take it as other than a love song.

I think the brass band at the beginning suggests state pomp, furthing underlining the literal meaning.

I just can't go the extra mile to see it as actually a love song to a nation.

The extra mile is actually the "personal" reading as it requires additional baggage to parse. The literal reading is quite clear. Mind you, I think the song supports both readings simultaneously - I think Neil is absolutely commenting on immigration (just look how overtly political the Fundamental era tracks are). More than that, I think the personal reading is subservient to the literal meaning; in other words, we're meant to see it as a plea for immigrant freedom and the "personal" reading is a deliberate device to make us sympathize on a personal level. Just like London.

Only better.

And yes, different interpretations are good.

Your Funny Uncle wrote:Well one thing I'm certainly not is anti-immigrant, especially as my wife will be applying for the titular visa later this year...

I wasn't suggesting for a moment that you were.

Drico.

DELETE

patrick wrote: The extra mile is actually the "personal" reading as it requires additional baggage to parse. The literal reading is quite clear. Mind you, I think the song supports both readings simultaneously - I think Neil is absolutely commenting on immigration (just look how overtly political the Fundamental era tracks are. More than that, I think the personal reading is subservient to the literal meaning; in other words, we're meant to see it as a plea for immigrant freedom and the "personal" reading is a deliberate device to make us sympathize on a personal level.

I realise that my original statement in this thread was a little blunt, but I have since acknowleded that the song can be read on multiple levels. It's just a question of emphasis. I see the literal as very much subservient to the metaphorical, and you see the reverse. Of course, whatever you or I may feel we're meant to think, we'll never know for sure unless Neil decides to tell us...

By the way, I should say that it's far too long since I've had a decent discussion about the interpretation of PSB lyrics. They used to go on so much more back in the days of dotmusic and hotboard...